Concorde, Europe-bashing, etc.

I didn't intend for my first posting to this group to generate a transatlantic flame war. If it makes you all feel any better, I will reveal that I voted for John Kerry, had a Kerry/Edwards sign on my lawn, donate money to the DNC, do not have any respect for George Bush and his Administration and anything it stands for and that I have enjoyed all 20 of my trips to Europe, lived happily in Belgium for 5 months, and I will REPEAT my wishes of Good Luck on the Huygens maneuver and my enjoyment of UFO and all things connected to it.

Now, back to the flames...

>If you have listened to any of the engineers who worked on Apollo &
>the Space Shuttle they will tell you that the Concorde was as
>difficult a challenge as was Apollo or the Space Shuttle to achieve.

Yes, Concorde was a tremendous achievement; and yet, if asked which vehicle I wanted to fly in to get to the moon, I would choose Apollo, not Concorde. We are talking about a space program here after all.

All the astronauts/Moonbase personnel that I can think of are British, if one goes by their accent. This seemed to me, and still seems, unlikely. (Maybe there are other exceptions besides Straker & Jackson (who seems Slavic despite his name?)

This is not criticism of the British, the UK, the ESA, the EU, the UN, SHADO, NASA, or anything. Just an observation.

>As SHADo was a UN run operation there is no reason to suppose that it
>would be based in the USA. The idea that Europe is unable to
>specialise in high tech establishments is just wrong. CERN being an
>example of the ability of Europe to produce something outstanding.

I think I never said it would be based in the USA, I never said Europe is "unable to specialise in high tech establishments." I said it seemed odd to me that it was an almost wholly British-staffed operation.

AS

CONTENTS DELETED

How about plausible deniability?!

Who's going to believe that a top secret alien defence organisation
is hiding under a movie studio in England? And to divert attention
perhaps Harlington-Straker studios put out a series of movies
featuring all the SHADO vehicles so that they can then claim that
they are just out shooting the next installment!

Also SHADO is working under tight budget management with Henderson
having to approve or bully the money into their coffers. I do not see
the need for SHADO to have to run any facilities for heavy lift
launches. Once Moonbase was established frequent small resupply trips
would be all that was needed and only the occasional exceptional
heavy launch (provided by NASA etc). Having to run such a facility
would increase the number of people that work for SHADO and that is
something I believe needs to be kept small. I believe the pad in
front of Moonbase is supposed to be for other larger vehicles to
land.

Personally I wouldn't like to go to the Moon in an Apollo capsule
(and that didn't land). I would rather prefer a reusable system to
get into space such as the BAC MUSTARD.

I think that's a good point. SHADO clearly operated under strong
financial control (such as the episode with the space junk) and had
limits on resources. Spending massive amounts of money on SHADO would
have attracted suspicion from the media, which is clearly one good
reason that in series one SHADO operates a fairly small force. Even
keeping the small Moonbase operational would cost billions.

Of couse in Anderson's plan for a second series of UFO Moonbase was
going to be huge and probably the main place to fight the war against
the Aliens, rather than having the security issues of a base on Earth.

As for Straker being recognised, well how many studio moguls would you
recognise on TV? none I'm betting. Straker ran the studio, I'm
guessing in reality he'd have someone like a press officer to speak to
the media anyway.

Martin


--- In [hidden email], "naughtyhector"
<barry_john.hinchliffe@n...> wrote:

> How about plausible deniability?!
>
> Who's going to believe that a top secret alien defence organisation
> is hiding under a movie studio in England?

Daily Sport readers :-)

> Personally I wouldn't like to go to the Moon in an Apollo capsule
> (and that didn't land). I would rather prefer a reusable system to
> get into space such as the BAC MUSTARD.

Good grief, it's amazing someone else remembers MUSTARD.


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

----- Original Message -----
From: "mps137" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Friday, January 14, 2005 4:49 AM


> As for Straker being recognised, well how many studio moguls would you
> recognise on TV? none I'm betting. Straker ran the studio, I'm
> guessing in reality he'd have someone like a press officer to speak to
> the media anyway.

Michael Eisner of Disney, for one. I don't know if Spielberg would count as
a mogul, but obviously he's recognizable.
And there are a couple of episodes where Straker meets up with reporters, so
it's not like he's a hermit or a recluse. Just seems dumb to me to be
showing your face and using your name in a top-secret capacity and also
having the same name on the outside of your studio and showing the same face
occasionally to the press.

Has anyone else noticed that there is a red leather (or leather-like)
minidress that makes three different appearances in the series, each time
worn by a different woman?

--- In [hidden email], "D Persica" <dennispersica@b...> wrote:
>
>
> Has anyone else noticed that there is a red leather (or leather-
like)
> minidress that makes three different appearances in the series,
each time
> worn by a different woman?

I remember the third appearance now, it was Sound of Silence. The
dress was probably in the Pinewood wardrobe department, all three
episodes(Psychbombs, Timelash, Sound of Silence) it appeared in were
shot at Pinewood Studios. I wouldn't be surprised if appeared in
other ITC series as well.

I hope they washed the knickers out!

Martin


--- In [hidden email], "D Persica" <dennispersica@b...> wrote:
>
>
> Has anyone else noticed that there is a red leather (or leather-like)
> minidress that makes three different appearances in the series, each
time
> worn by a different woman?

----- Original Message -----
From: "rj_demedeiros" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Friday, January 14, 2005 5:50 PM

> I remember the third appearance now, it was Sound of Silence. The
> dress was probably in the Pinewood wardrobe department, all three
> episodes(Psychbombs, Timelash, Sound of Silence) it appeared in were
> shot at Pinewood Studios.

I assumed it was a Sylvia Anderson creation.
Here's a shot of the top half of it.

http://www.scifilm.org/tv/ufo/ufo12.html

It's pretty much standard to reuse costumes in TV and films. There is a
short bit on The Avengers page about the fact that the outfit that Gabrielle Drake
wore in the episode The Hidden Tiger had been originally worn by Diana Rigg
in another episode(they must have had to let the top out some!) Probably if
you look over the whole series you'll spot other costumes making second and
third apperances.

James K.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In [hidden email], "D Persica" <dennispersica@b...> wrote:
>
>
> Has anyone else noticed that there is a red leather (or leather-
like)
> minidress that makes three different appearances in the series,
each time
> worn by a different woman?

Yep, noticed it, appreciated it, trying to get my girlfriend to get
one.

Nick

> Good grief, it's amazing someone else remembers MUSTARD.

Here are some links for anyone interested in what was being thought
up but not built in the 60's...

http://www.astronautix.com/craftfam/gemini.htm

http://www.astronautix.com/craft/dynasoar.htm

http://www.astronautix.com/articles/propter1.htm

http://www.spaceuk.org/index.htm

http://www.abo.fi/~mlindroo/SpaceLVs/Slides/index.htm

http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Launchpad/6133/60planes.html