Re: UFO 2 ideas.....

I tend to agree with James on the colonization theme - it's all over the
place - from The Invaders, to Dark Skies, First Wave, Earth: Final Conflict
et al. Let's give it a rest. Not only that, the aliens may not WANT to live
here - UFO always portrayed them as having probs surviving in our
atmosphere, etc. How many times have countries during the colonial periods
of the 16th, 17th, 18, and 19th centuries gone into other nations, taken
what they wanted (because they were more technologically advanced), and
shipped all the stuff they took home. Think the Spaniards in Mexico and
South America, the British and French in Canada, the Japanese in China.
Remember Mel Fisher's discovery of the Spanish galleon Atocha? What did he
find? Tons of New World gold, silver, emeralds, etc - removed by the
conquistadors and shipped home for usage in Spain itself.

In my own story, soon to appear in the SHADO Library ("Orion"), I've kept
the human organs angle plus the aliens trying to steal some of earth's
natural resources, certain types of human medical technology, anything at
all that could be useful to them, etc. The aliens in UFO are after all,
humanoid, and this makes them (in my ever so humble opinion) a bit more
sinister, in that they may soon be able to "walk among us" undetected,
stealing, kidnapping, doing whatever they want at will - making it even
harder for SHADO to battle them. Ugly aliens are great for shock value
alright, but they soon become boring - after all the 1950's and early 1960's
had their share of BEMs (bug-eyed monsters) in s-f films and TV shows. Trek
and UFO were among the first TV shows to give the aliens more than just
fearsome appearances - they gave them motives and meanings for their bad
behaviour.

This is OT, I know, but James - do you recollect which eps of Trek was
canned due to the S&M connotations? Is it the one in which Kirk and Uhura
share the first Tv interracial kiss? Just curious as to whether I've seen it
myself or not.....

Pam

--- In SHADO@y..., "Pam McCaughey" <editor@a...> wrote:
> I tend to agree with James on the colonization theme - it's all over
the
> place - from The Invaders, to Dark Skies, First Wave, Earth: Final
Conflict
> et al. Let's give it a rest. Not only that, the aliens may not WANT
to live
> here - UFO always portrayed them as having probs surviving in our
> atmosphere, etc. How many times have countries during the colonial
periods
> of the 16th, 17th, 18, and 19th centuries gone into other nations,
taken
> what they wanted (because they were more technologically advanced),
and
> shipped all the stuff they took home. Think the Spaniards in Mexico
and
> South America, the British and French in Canada, the Japanese in
China.
> Remember Mel Fisher's discovery of the Spanish galleon Atocha? What
did he
> find? Tons of New World gold, silver, emeralds, etc - removed by the
> conquistadors and shipped home for usage in Spain itself.
>
> In my own story, soon to appear in the SHADO Library ("Orion"), I've
kept
> the human organs angle plus the aliens trying to steal some of
earth's
> natural resources, certain types of human medical technology,
anything at
> all that could be useful to them, etc. The aliens in UFO are after
all,
> humanoid, and this makes them (in my ever so humble opinion) a bit
more
> sinister, in that they may soon be able to "walk among us"
undetected,
> stealing, kidnapping, doing whatever they want at will - making it
even
> harder for SHADO to battle them. Ugly aliens are great for shock
value
> alright, but they soon become boring - after all the 1950's and
early 1960's
> had their share of BEMs (bug-eyed monsters) in s-f films and TV
shows. Trek
> and UFO were among the first TV shows to give the aliens more than
just
> fearsome appearances - they gave them motives and meanings for their
bad
> behaviour.
>
> This is OT, I know, but James - do you recollect which eps of Trek
was
> canned due to the S&M connotations? Is it the one in which Kirk and
Uhura
> share the first Tv interracial kiss? Just curious as to whether I've
seen it
> myself or not.....
>
> Pam


Hi Pam
Probably the GAMESTERS OF TRISKELLION episode with the crew being
whipped in chains and the fetching young lady in the silver bikini.
Also,welcome to Thomas...we keep bumping into each other,huh?
Charles

"Pam McCaughey" wrote:

> This is OT, I know, but James - do you recollect which eps of Trek was
> canned due to the S&M connotations? Is it the one in which Kirk and Uhura
> share the first Tv interracial kiss? Just curious as to whether I've seen it
> myself or not.....
>

Hi Pam,

No, it's not that one. I did see it once, years ago as part of
a special series in which programmes which had been censored or
banned were shown. I only remember it very vaguely, but I'm sure
it involves some poor alien woman being whipped or something ..

James

[hidden email] wrote:

> Hi Pam
> Probably the GAMESTERS OF TRISKELLION episode with the crew being
> whipped in chains and the fetching young lady in the silver bikini.
>

That sounds very like it .. :)

CONTENTS DELETED

Hi Charles!
I DO recall the Trek eps "Gamesters of Triskelion"! It had yet another space
babe who was keen for Kirk.....sorry, Marc about the OT comments.....

Going back to UFO, the idea of the aliens taking what we have, as opposed to
our planet itself, makes more sense. If they are a dying race (as stipulated
in the series), then their personal resources are probably wearing thin, and
actually taking over another planet (with all the loss, expense and
logistics of all-out war and then leaving behind an occupying force) might
be beyond their current capacities or needs. A dying race is more concerned
with survival than conquest, even if they are technologically superior.
Their population may have been decimated through disease, wars, poisoning
their own environment, etc. Any number of things could have gone wrong on
their own world. The original UFO series depicts the aliens as viewing us as
cattle - something to use for their own ends. This is not unlike what human
researchers have been doing for years with lab animals. Humans also "abduct"
all kinds of animals in their own habitats, knock them out with
tranquillizer darts, perform medical experiments and tests on them, and even
"tag" them with radio transmitters to track their movements once they're set
free again. If you were a polar bear in the Arctic, and you lost 4-5 hrs our
of your day, what would you think? Especially about that weird thing that
suddenly appeared around your neck? Do these scientists worry about how the
bear is going to feel about his "abduction" dreams and flashbacks? I don't
think so.....

Soooo, if humans can do that to creatures they share their own world with,
how much easier would it be for aliens from another system to see humans in
the same light? We would become the subjects of experiments, tests, "what
have you" for them, and they wouldn't feel any different about it than human
researchers do about the bears, wolves, etc they trap for scientific
purposes.

If the aliens are humanoid, that makes their mission here even more cruel.
They are like us, and yet they are not. They don't even see us as equals.
Their technical superiority and their desperation have driven them to
consider their own needs first. Humans become incidental. And, when the
humans start to fight back (i.e. SHADO), the aliens change their tactics to
meet the change in US. Their need for survival hasn't changed. They simply
have to go about things differently.

Also, if their own ecology was seriously damaged, they might be interested
in what we are doing here to clean up our own messes. Scientific research
done by us might be applicable to their situation in some ways. But, because
they consider humans beneath them, they are not willing to place themselves
in the position of supplication to peaceably acquire what we have by making
nice deals or making friends with us. Instead, they steal whatever it is
they need.

Did the Spaniards really care about the natives when they roared into
Central and South America? They used their advanced technology to remove
them as a threat, and brought disease, a new religion and other items from
their own culture to further decimate the native populace. They didn't see
the natives as equal - they saw them as primitives. They bled them dry of
whatever the natives had of value and sent if off home by the boatload.
There are plenty of other examples in earth's history of this kind of
behaviour by humans against humans.

An argument could also be made for another alien race taking pity on us
hapless humans, and coming to assist us against the original alien threat.
Unless they've all got some sort of "Prime Directive" thing going and decide
against interfering. At any rate, I see the UFO aliens as takers who really
don't see us as deserving of their consideration.

Ciao for now - Pam

I'm not really sure how derivative the new UFO wants to be. We've had a
spate of invasion-themed movies lately - everything from "V" on TV (gak -
that was an awful one!), to Independence Day and Mars Attacks! I agree they
are going to be looking for a much wider audience this time, and may take a
lesson from such successful pix as MIB and ID, which combined elements of
the alien menace with a good dose of humour here and there. Star Trek moved
beyond its own fandom when the fourth movie (the whale story) came out. The
ecologically-based screenplay, placing the cast in those "fish out of water"
scenes on good ol' terra firma, and the legitimate laughs made it the best
of the lot as far as reaching out to non-Trek movie-goers.

UFO has at present a select "sure" audience and must work to get people to
take it seriously in its new incarnation. I almost think a 4 hr miniseries
might be the best idea, rather than a theatrical release. You pack alot more
of everything into a miniseries, including character development, plotlines,
hardware, etc. That's how V became a series. I'm also concerned that GA's
involvement, even his name on the credits might scare people away - after
all - he's mostly known for his puppet shows - and there are some viewers
who never saw UFO but "know" about Thunderbirds and classify them as
kiddie-fare.

In some ways, UFO2 may have to start from scratch, simply to eradicate all
those items from the original that wouldn't work today. Like the purple
wigs, ha ha. They'll obviously want to introduce new characters, as well as
(we hope) bringing back some of the originals (i.e. Bishop, Billington, et
al). SHADO itself will have undergone some radical changes in the
intervening years, and the technology in every area must be updated - will
they be using cell phones, laptops, etc? S-F takes an enormous creative team
and time to consider all these parameters, and how they will be resolved,
then developed realistically as sets, models, SFX, SGI. And, there really
has to be some sort of "bridge" which brings us from the past into the
present time of the movie/mini-series. In order to boost viewership, would
the producers consider trying to attract some current name actors/actresses
to take roles, in addition to participation by the original actors? There
has to be SOME reason for modern viewers to tune in - esp those NOT familiar
with the show at all. In order to differentiate themselves, UFO2 will have
to offer something apart from the invasion theme. A plot twist. A catch.

UFO's original premise was interesting enough to get us to contribute ideas
to a web-site 30 yrs after the show went out of production - to keep
watching those few episodes made way back when. So let's hope what hooked
us, will "hook" a whole new generation of UFO fans!

Pam

CONTENTS DELETED

Well, I'm not suggesting Leonardo DiCaprio or Matt Damon for UFO - certainly
not. But, there are good viewer draws such as Alec Baldwin or one of the
Bridges brothers, who can lend their names to such a project. Their
reputations as solid performers are strong. As for music, well, there are
plenty of good composers who've written for s-f before (Jerry Goldsmith for
instance). Bringing UFO up to speed in the new millennium doesn't mean they
have to sully it with the wrong people. I certainly don't think Mr. Moffat &
Company are going to ruin their own credibility in the s-f movie game by
catering to the teenie boppers exclusively. If they are trying to appeal to
an adult audience with UFO2, then they will choose accordingly.

Recent films such as "Mission: Impossible", "Charlie's Angels" (which I
studiously avoided), etc do not in my mind constitute re-makes. What they do
is take the original premise, and strip it of everything that made the
original popular, and re-mold it to satisfy the 15-22 age group. If Mr.
Moffat is enlisting the assistance of GA and EB, then I don't think that is
his game plan. I'm speculating wildly here of course! But, the above
mentioned movies were not particularly popular with the original age group
which watched them on TV - so what does that tell you? Of those folks I know
who saw MI or MI2, immense disappointment was the watchword.

Let's hope, after years of hoping, that when UFO2 makes it to the public,
they will have found a way to preserve the flavour of the original and make
the changes necessary to help it appeal to an even wider audience. I'm not
saying they should sell out to do this - just make those changes with
caution. And, much as I hate to say this - move the story out of Britain and
make it more "global" in the sense that elements of the storyline are
occurring all over the world. I have often wondered if UFO's British locale
impeded some of its popularity. Certainly, today, the story would encompass
the entire planet.

Ciao for now - Pam

"Pam McCaughey" wrote:
> Well, I'm not suggesting Leonardo DiCaprio or Matt Damon for UFO - certainly
> not. But, there are good viewer draws such as Alec Baldwin or one of the
> Bridges brothers, who can lend their names to such a project.

Alec Baldwin would be great in an Alec Freeman kind of role, I
think .. actually I was surprised to see how old he looks these
days when I saw him on .. oh I've forgotten the name. The late
night chat show with the guy with the 1980s double-breasted
suit. I suppose it IS 10 years or so since Red October, now.

But I personally would love to see George Sewell in the Alec
Freeman role again. It's not that long since he was playing a
senior police officer in The Detectives so it's a reasonable
proposition.

But, I must say I think there's only a very slim chance that
UFO2 will happen at all, whether film, TV series or whatever.


> Recent films such as "Mission: Impossible", "Charlie's Angels" (which I
> studiously avoided), etc do not in my mind constitute re-makes. What they do
> is take the original premise, and strip it of everything that made the
> original popular, and re-mold it to satisfy the 15-22 age group.


But if it DOES happen, see above ..

> Moffat is enlisting the assistance of GA and EB, then I don't think that is
> his game plan. I'm speculating wildly here of course! But, the above
> mentioned movies were not particularly popular with the original age group
> which watched them on TV - so what does that tell you? Of those folks I know
> who saw MI or MI2, immense disappointment was the watchword.
>

Well count me out, it may have been nothing like the original
but I loved the 1990s version of MI. And although MI2 was
EXTRAORDINARILY shallow and throwaway, it had some of the most
stylish action scenes I can ever remember.

I said hi to Tom Cruise in HK when he was there for the premiere
of MI2. Did I mention that at the time? Yes, I think I did ..

James

Hi from Simon the newbie again

I think the UFO 2 idea sounds wonderful to say the least....
There seems to be some concern n the group arond marketting the UFO concept
to a new generation- if recent popular movies are anything to go by then all
that is required is a lead with good teeth, good biceps and a small tatoo
somewhere combined with 'modernised' (read hip-hop beat added
inappropriatley) music and some glam special effects. The recent offerings
from the US of A (sorry to US fans) seem to lack story line but have lots of
whiz bangs. So (cutting to the chase) what we need is a some thought
provoking scripting and story writing that includes the old cast in suitably
diginified and updated roles and some hollywood to sell it... me thinks

Just a note on the actual composition of the UFO2 theme(s) - the intervening
(30 !!!) years amy have seemed long to us humans who lived them but in
celestial terms it is a relativley short period of time. We here on earth
have managed to find several new and better ways to destroy ourselves in
this time, I imagine that the Aliens will have become more desperate as
thier population and planeary situation deteriorates. Therefore they might
become far more reckless and aggressive in pursuit of their immediate needs
and long term goals (? the old colonisation/cross breeding theme). At the
same time the large drain on international resources and the increasingly
aggressive nature of the menace may have rendered it both impossible and
undesirable to keep the Alien menace secret from the international
community. You could then picture SHADO absorbing the worlds armed forces
(and their budgets) to form a much larger, more diverse and comprehensive
force. Constant armed conflict gives rise to increased technological growth
and as has been said, absorption of Alien technology allows travel at
relativisitic speeds. All in all, if we survived this long I believe that we
would either have become irreversibly infiltrated by aliens or be more than
equal to the task of defending ourselves and even applying a little reverse
discrimination.
Cheers
Simon


_________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

From: Pam McCaughey <[hidden email]>

> Well, I'm not suggesting Leonardo DiCaprio or Matt Damon for
UFO - certainly
> not. But, there are good viewer draws such as Alec Baldwin or
one of the
> Bridges brothers,

[...]

Scrap Baldwin, he's flaky.

Paul

I think Nicholas Cage would be a suitably dark character for a SHADO agent,
possibly as Dr. Jackson?
I can't get Alec Baldwin out of my head as Mr. Conductor in Thomas & the
Magic Railroad.

Grant.

-Original message-
Alec Baldwin would be great in an Alec Freeman kind of role, I
think .. actually I was surprised to see how old he looks these
days when I saw him on .. oh I've forgotten the name. The late
night chat show with the guy with the 1980s double-breasted
suit. I suppose it IS 10 years or so since Red October, now.





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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> Probably the GAMESTERS OF TRISKELLION episode with the crew
> being whipped in chains and the fetching young lady in the silver
> bikini. Also,welcome to Thomas...we keep bumping into
> each other,huh?

Charles,

Yes, we seem to have the same interests:
1960's series first and sci-fi forever!
Do you like "Space: 1999"?
***UFO Out***

Thomas

Boy - Nick Cage - now there's an interesting idea for UFO2 - Alec B. might
be a good idea for Alec F - after all - Baldwin has that ability to play to
the ladies, ha ha. What about Mel Gibson? Or kate Winslet as Col. Lake? Pam

Pam McCaughey wrote<editor@a...>
>
> > Well, I'm not suggesting Leonardo DiCaprio or Matt Damon for
> > UFO - certainly not.

Not Leo DiCRAPio.

> > But, there are good viewer draws such as Alec Baldwin

Not Baldwin either. I though he was going to leave the US after Bushie
got elected. (I wish he'd take his brothers with him). Any of you
across the Atlantic want him?

> > or one of the Bridges brothers,

Just as long as it's Jeff <KERPLOP!>.

But seriously, Beau is probably the better actor, unfortunately he
doesn't have his brother's looks. Take your pick.

I agree with you on the DiCrapio (vbg) issue - I didn't even think he was
right to play opposite Kate in James Cameron's Titanic! I don't know if
looks has to be such an issue with a UFO movie. After all, George Sewell,
charming as he is, has been a popular character actor without being a Robert
Redford type......Oh wouldn't I love to see Pierce Brosnan in a UFO movie -
he's doing one last JB movie I hear....What about someone like Eric Roberts
- he's moody and can play weird when he wants to.

Pam

[hidden email] wrote:

> In a message dated 2/14/01 7:39:10 AM Pacific Standard Time, [hidden email]
> writes:
>
> > I tend to agree with James on the colonization theme - it's all over the
> > place - from The Invaders, to Dark Skies, First Wave, Earth: Final Conflict
> > et al. Let's give it a res
>
> And X-Files, for a particularily well known one.

And War of the Worlds ...
------------------

[hidden email] wrote:

> Hi everybody

Hi, Alison! {{:-)

WooHoo! A gal with TASTE! Now, me? It's the chest hair ... {{;-)

> I am not sure if I can offer the in-depth views that you all express over the
> group e-mail, but I read them with interest, and I hope that I might make
> some valuable contribution at some point!
> Until that auspicious moment.... I will continue to read and take interest.
> Bye for now

Welcome to the list Alison!!
(Belated, I know - been away from the list a few days and now have 45
unread messages <sigh>)


> Re: my crush on Colonel Foster, I really love the photo of him in the
> sauna taken from Ordeal, it makes a really good screensaver!!!!!

Great wallpaper, too! {{8-)
---------------

[hidden email] wrote:

> Alison wrote:
> > I only found out about this group after purchasing my
> > first computer last year.
>
> I joined last month. Everyone here is real nice.
> (Especially Pam and Yuchtar)

<SPUTZ SPUTTER COFF COFF CHOKE>

Heh.

LOL! I sure hope you have a kerplop cushion! :-D
-------------

Marc Martin wrote:

> Gerry despises Sylvia... he's prevented her participation in anything
> involving Fanderson... even on the Carlton and A&E THUNDERBIRDS DVDs,
> an old 1965 documentary on the making of the series had all scenes
> with Syvlia cut out of it due to Gerry's request!!!

Oh, well, that's just PETTY. ):-\
---------------

[hidden email] wrote:

> Here's my list:
> "Ordeal"
> (completely vicious: the liquid breathing)

Sauna scene .....

> "Kill Stryker!"
> (no comments)

Foster in silver jumpsuit unzipped to the navel ....

> "Timelash"
> (I'm a frozen time addict)

Disheveled Straker ......

> "Mindbender"
> (the plot is fabulous:
> the film into the film premise is surrealistic)

Disheveled Straker AND disheveled Foster

KERPLOP!

(good choices :)
--------------

[hidden email] wrote:

> Not Baldwin either. I though he was going to leave the US after Bushie
> got elected. (I wish he'd take his brothers with him). Any of you
> across the Atlantic want him?

TTTTTTTHHHHHHHHHSSSSSSSPPPPPPPPPTTTTTT!

You're not getting rid of one of the most gorgeous guys on the planet
just when he's becomming available again!

> > > or one of the Bridges brothers,
>
> Just as long as it's Jeff <KERPLOP!>.

Beau has gorgeous eyes.
--------------
Marc Martin wrote:

> And PLEASE people -- when replying to a message on this list, do
> NOT include the original message in your reply. ESPECIALLY
> if you are digest mode! People who violate this rule (or any
> of the list rules) will be put into moderation mode, which means
> that your posts will be first need to be reviewed by me, and
> risk being edited or rejected.

Ut-Oh! We can't quote ANY of the original message? I'm in trouble right
now, then aren't I?
8-\
Or do you just mean the WHOLE message? <nod nod> Yeah, that digest was
41K - got ya ......
---------------

[hidden email] wrote:

> On the subject of Colonel Foster............again?........I know I can't help
> it!! Would anyone think I was strange if I said that I also used to have a
> crush on Captain Scarlet and Virgil from Thunderbirds? Is this normal? Are
> there any others out there? If so, do we need therapy?
>
> Alison PS. I guess the strings could get in the way!!!!

<blink blink>

ROFLMAO!
------------

mildred fazio wrote:

> I am new to the discussion group.

Welcome to the list, Mildred!!

And that catches me up - hope this isn't too long or too off topic

Ciao for now!

-- Yuchtar, the friendly Klingon with a flame thrower


--
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Yuchtar zantai-Klaan | [hidden email]
I am not a number! I am a FREE FAN!
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
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control Social Security like it was
some kind of federal program."
-- George W. Bush
=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
http://yuchtar.users4.50megs.com/
http://nunzie.users2.50megs.com/

At 15:36 14/02/01 -0500, you wrote:
>I'm not really sure how derivative the new UFO wants to be. We've had a
>spate of invasion-themed movies lately - everything from "V" on TV (gak -
>that was an awful one!), to Independence Day and Mars Attacks! I agree they

For some reason I loved V - may have something to do with the lead actor
being handsome? But then beauty is in the eyes of the beholder...
Why not have the aliens do ore or less like they did in UFO - different
aliens coming in for different purposes. Gives the writers more leeway, I
would say.
And I wouldn't have too many of the original cast, they are all getting
older, if one wants a UFO2 to be a success one needs young actors that
appeal to the masses. Not exactly the cup of tea for die-hard UFO fans
perhaps, but one needs to be realistic. After all, some people do like the
Star Trek spin-offs (I do not, but they are supposed to be successful...)

CU

Lieve



Col. Lieve Peten, Commander MarsBase - Mailto:[hidden email]

"That's what life is all about, I guess - The things we never say."
Cmdr. Ed Straker, UFO Series, Subsmash episode.

SHADO/UFO pages : http://shado.simplenet.com/aspects
MarsBase/UFO: http://shado.iwarp.com

Amelia wrote:


>God. I do not want to see any actors and actresses who haven't even gotten
>through puberty, but still are big money makers show up in this movie merely
>so that it will draw a larger audience. Sorry. I know it has to attract a
>larger audience to make back the costs that will go into it, but eee! My
>opinion alone, perhaps, but YECCCH. God. And the music. A UFO theme by
>Enimen..(g)

Actually if they keep one thing, I hope it's the theme music!
Is God on this list, BTW? Never seen him post? Yet you address him twice
:-) :-)

What concerns the actors discussed (in as far as I know their names, I
never take much notice of actor names I'm afraid), aren't they all
well-known actors? If so, would they want to participate in a series? Of
course, if they brought out a full length UFO movie it would be different.
And I still want Roy Dupuis at SHADO somewhere, as commander or second in
command or some such (with or without Peta Wilson aka Nikita :-)
I can't quite see Ed Straker in a role resembling the Henderson role.
Henderson worried about the commission and the budget etc (he must have
been stuck with the same civil servants that ruled Jim Hacker, wasn't the
Yes Minister series made around the same time? :-) I can't see Straker
worry about anything but the good of SHADO and the destruction of the
aliens.... Maybe Straker goes on to run the film company for real, makes a
huge profit, and they use that to keep SHADO running? Unless he listened
to James T. Kirk (who hated his retirement) and never allowed anyone to
promote him away from the action...

CU

Lieve



* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* Lieve Peten, Vlaanderen, Belgium : Mailto:[hidden email]
* Internet Sites link page: http://pinball.iwarp.com/mysites.html
* The Pinball Site * Loch Ness + UFOs in Belgium * Vangelis *
* Nikita * UFO TV-series * Animated Gifs * Andrea Bocelli *