The military rank system

Hi all,

I suppose that the rank system of SHADO follows that ot USAF, because
ex-Gen. Henderson and ex-Col. Straker from the same armed force
extablished the SHADO.

Then, I would like to ask a question to the members who are well
versed in military subjects.

Freeman, Foster, and Lake are all called "Colonel".
Are they all belong to the same rank?
Is not there any possibility that some of them are the lieutenant
colonels?

Likewise, Ellis, Harrington, Barry and Ford are all called
"Lieutenant".
I wonder some of them are the first lieutents, and the others are the
second ones?

Lastly, in which rank Cmdr. Straker belongs to, colonel or the higher
rank?


Kaoru

Well, SHADO seems to have a ranking system all it's own. There is no
Commander rank in the Air Force and I believe an AF Colonel would
outrank a Naval Commander. Paul and Alec are Colonels, but Carlin is a
Captain - is he an AF Captain or a Navy Captain? He commands Skydiver,
after all. A Navy Captain far outranks an AF Captain.

I don't think they paid much attention to that, really - they probably
didn't expact fans to pick it apart the way we do. :)

-- Y


tchbnk wrote:


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I'm probably just as guilty of not understanding the military ranking system
with SHADO. In my ca year 2000 series of fanfic stories, I've elevated
Straker, Foster and Freeman to the rank of General, and Peter Carlin to
Admiral. And altho I'd consider Straker's rank to be the equivelent of a
four star General (a la the American army) I realize that the rankings could
be based on the USAF. However, that being said, I felt the rank of Admiral
worked well for Peter Carlin as he'd been a 'navy' man throughout the
original series.

Pam

Hi,

I thikn an organisation like SHADO would have to run on similar lines,
rank-wise, to something like the British security services, which have their
own ranks. These are comparable to other forces, eg a Higher Executive
Officer equalling a Major in the British Army, the same way as you can
compare ranks between, say, the RN and RAF.

They'd really have to do that just to stop arguments from personnel coming
from different backgrounds, and different countries.

Jess

On 21 Jun 2003 at 4:58, tchbnk wrote:
Very possible. We call Lt. Col. Colonel, although, behind their backs, they
may be called 'light colonel'... depends on the person.

> Likewise, Ellis, Harrington, Barry and Ford are all called
> "Lieutenant".
> I wonder some of them are the first lieutents, and the others are the
> second ones?
>
I doubt if any of them are still 'butter-bars', they're probably all silver bars.
There are a LOT of lieutenants, although, if they don't make captain within a
reasonable time, they're out the gate.

> Lastly, in which rank Cmdr. Straker belongs to, colonel or the higher
> rank?
>
I'm not quite sure why they call him Commander, although he IS the 'base
commander/wing commander'. Commander is a Navy rank, equal to either a
major or Lt. Colonel, so obviously they are using it in the sense of unit
commander, rather than rank.

Carlin, if they're using Navy ranks, is a Captain, equal to a full-bird colonel.

I would suspect that the 'commander' is probably at the very least a one-star,
although most base commanders tend to have two stars (Major General).
Which could mean that he's equal in Rank to Henderson - although since
Henderson has more 'time-in-grade', he's got seniority and in a joint mission
would be in charge as the 'ranking' general.

There are remarkably few majors and captains, but that could be how they
set it up. Deciding that certain 'ranks' are required for certain jobs. In my
unit, we have a full bird as the director, his second is a civilian equal in grade
to a lt. col. Under him, he's got two civilians equal to full bird, one lt. col, as
well as two civilians equal to majors. Under one of the civilians equal to full
bird, he's got a civilian deputy equal to lt. col., a major (sometimes two - but
the second one just earned his promotion and is about to be reassigned), a
captain, two Senior Staff Sergeants, and a technical sergeant.

In all, it's fairly 'normal', as far as ranks go - certainly close enough to my
reality that I can handle it. Of course, I'm rather of the opinion that at least
some of the 'colonels' are really civilians (Col Lake, for example - she's
obviously NOT military) with equivelant 'rank' (GS-14 or 15, if you care).

Hope I haven't added to the confusion.

TAE

This is my take on the rank in SHADO.

Commander: is used to identify Straker as the Commander in Chief(CiC) of
SHADO. Straker's actual rank is mostly likely to be that of a Brigadier General
which he was promoted to from Colonel when he took command.

Colonel: there are three colonels in SHADO, Freeman, Foster and Lake. The
standard military practice is the officer who obtained his rank first is
considered to be the ranking officer of those who have the same rank. Freeman was a
colonel before Shado was started so he would outrank Foster and Lake. The
question is did Lake or Foster become a Colonel first. I have alway thought it
was Lake who made it first.

Major:You never hear of this rank in SHADO. They must be the ones who do all
the paper work behinds the scenes.

Captain:The rank of captain is the same in the Air Force, Army and Marines,
but in the Navy the rank is equal to that of a Colonel. I think the rank in
SHADO stick to the other three so Carlin and the other captains in SHADO would
be equal to a Navy Lieutenant.

Lieutenant:SHADO is loaded with Lieutenants. I think the one big mistake in
the series was not making Lt. Ellis a Captain. Her character replace the
Italian actor who was to have been a Captain in the series so clearly someone
slipped up leaving her a Lieutenant.

Justs keep things straight here is a list of what ranks equal what in other
services.
ARMY, AIR FORCE & MARINES equals NAVY
-------------------------------------------------
----------------
General Admiral

Colonel Captain

Major Commander

Captain Lieutenant

Lieutenant Ensign

Sergeant Chief Petty
Officer

Corporal Petty Officer

Private Seaman


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[hidden email] wrote:

No, this is not quite right.
See http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0004604.html
and http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparative_military_ranks

US System
NAVY ................ OTHERS
E1 Seaman Recruit Private/Airman Basic
E2 Seaman Apprentice Private/Pvt 1st Class/Airman
E3 Seaman PFC/Lance Corporal/Airman 1st Class
E4 Petty Officer, 3rd Corporal/Sr. Airman
E5 Petty Officer, 2nd Sergeant/Staff Sergeant
E6 Petty Officer, 1st Staff Sergeant/Technical Sergeant
E7 CPO Sergeant, 1st Class/Gunnery Sgt/Master Sgt
E8 Sr. Chief PO Master Sergeant/Sr. Master Sgt
E9 Master Chief PO Sergeant Major/Master Gunnery Sgt/Chief Master
Sgt.

W1 Warrant Officer
W2-W5 Chief Warrant Officer

O1 Ensign 2nd Lieutenant
O2 Lt. Jr. Grade 1st Lt.
O3 Lieutenant Captain
O4 Lt. Commander Major
O5 Commander Lt. Colonel
O6 Captain Colonel
O7 Rear Admiral (L) Brigadier General
O8 Rear Admiral Major General
O9 Vice Admiral Lt. General
O10 Admiral General

The RAF looks completely different - no Colonel in the RAF - at least,
not in WWII, which is what that web site is comparing ....

Kevin Lazenby wrote:

> With Foster, his rank is fully a military rank, he is also senior to
> Colonel Lake. I think with Colonel Lake, her rank was an honourary one, as
> she was a civilian researcher working for one of the SHADO out based
> civilian research groups.

Why does Lake's rank have to be "honorary?" Cuz she's a lowly woman?
HMPH. Paul was a civilian too. They both got their rank after their
SHADO training. And, since Lake took over Freeman's role, I'd say she
outranks Foster. <arms folded, sticking my tongue out at the sexist Mr.
Lazenby>

-- Y


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I am not a number! I am a FREE FAN!
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
"So, Scully, is this boyish display of
agility turning you on at all?"
-- Fox Mulder
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